Jenny (00:29)
I have a very special guest today on the podcast, one of my students, Karen Kohuth from Greenhouse on Greendell in New Jersey. Karen and her husband Dan originally started their farm as a microgreens business, but after experimenting with cut flowers, they realized that's where their passion and potential really were. So now they've transitioned.
fully into cut flowers and have been making incredible strides in their business. In fact, this year alone, they've increased their sales by 27%, which is absolutely amazing. And Karen credits a big part of that growth to what she learned inside of my business program, Six Figure Flower Farming. She told me that the course helped her transform her farm from a fly by the seat of my pants kind of business.
into a true thriving flower farm with a clear plan and strategy. So Karen and I first met a few years ago when she came to a tour that I hosted through the ASCFG or the Association of Especially Teacup Flower Growers. And she later told me that seeing how I ran my own farm gave her the clarity and the confidence to sort of dig deeper and to sign up for six-figure flower farming. And in her own words, I did not pay her to say this,
She told me it was the best money she's ever spent on a course. So today we're diving into Karen's journey, what her farm looked like before she took the course, the shifts that she made along the way and the amazing results that she is seeing and experiencing now, including going on vacation multiple times a year. So you're going to love hearing her story. So let's jump in.
Jenny (02:11)
hey, Karen, welcome to the show. I'm good. I am so happy that you're here to join us today. And I have been really impressed with everything that you've done since we've met. So can you just give everyone like a really brief, like one minute, tell us about you, your farm, what you do?
Karen (02:13)
Hey Jenny, how are you?
Okay, so our farm started out as like we Dan and I started growing microgreens and then we kind of morphed into adding edible flowers to the mix and at that time I found out that there are a lot of edible flowers that are cut flowers. I'm like, well, we've got property. So I'm like, hey, let's kind of parlay this over into flowers. So we did both for about two years and it was just too much. So this past year is our third year growing flowers and we
cut out the microgreens completely. So it's much more manageable with just one product than two different product lines completely. So that certainly has been a big change for us. And it's working out overall, working out better. It's still, you know, hectic, but that's part of the job, right?
Jenny (03:19)
Yeah, I feel
like you're always managing that hectic craziness of it for at least the first few years. then even after that, there's still some hectic and crazy things that pop up from time to time. that's great. So what made you decide to drop the microgreens and just focus on the flowers?
Karen (03:30)
Yeah
Yeah, I imagine so.
Well, one, it was just too much trying to get outside, managing the harvesting, managing irrigation, weeds, weeds and weeds. And it was just too much trying to keep up with what needs to be watered, what needs to be, what trays need to be seeded, cleaning the trays. was just the management of it was way too much. ⁓ And honestly, I enjoyed the flowers more. And if we're going to be very honest, the flowers bring in more money. ⁓
Jenny (03:52)
Hahaha!
Karen (04:11)
But I mean, that's obviously a huge plus, but it wasn't the only decision behind it. So, yeah, so cut flowers ended up being quite profitable for us and we run three farmers markets. Well, we don't run them. go to, we attend, we then add them and we were well received in all three of them. So it's worked out very well.
Jenny (04:35)
That's great to hear. And I think
for people who are listening to this and hear Karen saying like, it was too much to manage. There's so much to do. And if you're somebody who's feeling like overwhelmed and like you're juggling a thousand things, which I feel like I just talk to people all the time that are doing that know that it's okay to niche down and focus on one thing and it's going to free up your time and your space. just sounds like it was way more profitable for you to do that. So.
You know, we met, it's been a few years now since we met, but we first started working together in six-figure flower farming. And I know a lot has changed from you in those few short years. So give me a little bit of an idea of what your business looked like before we met and started working together in the six-figure flower farming course.
Karen (05:07)
Yes.
Well, let's just say it was chaotic. ⁓ It was me. I was the one who was driving what we were growing and I was growing way too much of many different things. And even though I read multiple times, don't do that, just try and focus in on some like 10 or less flowers. No, I don't do that. I just kind of dove in and did way too many. ⁓ Then the next year kind of cut it back ⁓ and then cut it back more.
And this year, when I did our crop planning after taking the course, it was much more tailored to what I needed for my bouquets. And moving forward into for next year, I've already started planning what I'm going to do. And that's tailored even more, more specific, more like we talked about during this past summer's on-farm workshop where it's more color blocking.
and kind of getting things better organized so this way I stand out even more than the other ⁓ veggie farmer, flower growers that are at the markets with us.
Jenny (06:34)
Yeah, so it sounds like before it was very chaotic, really a plan in place, kind of flying by the seat of your pants, but now you have a very clear vision, it sounds like, and a very clear plan of exactly what you're going and why. So there's like a purpose for everything. Did I get that right? Perfect. So how is it feeling now versus before?
Karen (06:51)
Yes, yes you did.
I'm not gonna lie there is still a little bit of chaos going on but that has really more to do with ⁓ Dan and I my husband and I we both work off farms off farm jobs So and that's kind of a struggle my husband was working from home for years and that allowed for irrigation weeding Transplanting all the stuff right during the day when I couldn't get to it And now he's back out on the road. So that was a big change for us
Jenny (07:01)
Yeah.
Karen (07:27)
so less less chaotic more manageable definitely more efficiencies are put into place definitely more ⁓ standard operating procedures that is We do have them in place We do have issues with a lot of turnover of employees for various reasons It's it is frustrating, but it kind of goes with the territory. I understand so i'm hoping to kind of
nail that down. I do have an interview today at 11, so wish me luck. Yes.
Jenny (07:55)
⁓ exciting. Good luck. Yeah,
I know we're just starting. When you came to the On Farm Workshop this summer, we dove deeper into hiring, employee management, employee retention. And that's actually a new module. I think I told you this already, but it's a new module that we added to the online course for this next coming round, which I'm really excited about because I feel like it is a missing.
piece for a lot of people and it's just so critical, but no one really teaches you how to like actually find those A players and how to retain them. And like you said, like there's always going to be some turnover. Just, I think it's just the nature of the farming business and having a seasonal business, but it sounds like you're really moving in the right direction. So what would you say your biggest success has been with your business and what do you attribute
that success too.
Karen (08:53)
⁓ The biggest change is focusing in more honestly on the business aspects of the business, not just the growing of the flowers. I I know how to grow flowers. I mean, I didn't know how to grow all of these flowers, but I certainly learned and have plenty of resources for that. But the business aspect was really difficult. I've never had a business before. I had a general understanding of how things work.
But the day-to-day operations of making sure that people are working making sure that the operating procedures are in place so that if me or Dan are not here, somebody has access to how we would like things done. How to find out whether our crops are actually making money for us is a huge thing because we don't know. It's kind of like, all right, we're just buying stuff and hoping for the best. And sure, we're selling a lot.
But at the same time, we're not really sure whether we're actually making money off of a particular flower. So we need to drill down even more on that in the coming year. This year it just didn't happen. But I have the resources for it. And to me, that's very important to make sure that if I'm growing buplorum, that buplorum is actually doing its job in making us money.
Jenny (10:12)
Mm-hmm. I stopped growing bupilarum a few years ago. Not to say that it can't make you money, because I'm sure it definitely can. But that was one that we were like, you know, I just don't love it. And it wasn't earning its keep for us. But yeah, so is that something that you learned during the course, like the importance of understanding kind of like your numbers and making sure that what you were doing was actually earning you a profit?
Karen (10:15)
Hahaha
Absolutely. So like when I came to your farm through the AFCFG Farm Tour, I mean, I saw how you were running things. And to me, it was just kind of like this gal's got her stuff together. So I wanted to follow up with that. And then the course was coming out and then I signed up for it because I wanted a real business course, not one that's just going to give me a bunch of fluff. I wanted substance behind it. And your course absolutely did that. know, between the ⁓ every time we met.
you know, the different weekly sessions for the six weeks, plus all of the forms, the tools, the worksheets, the spreadsheets, all of that, kind of all, it all comes together. It's a lot. I'm not going to say it's not. There's a lot of information to consume, but it's information that we all need to know. So I ended up this past year, I took the course in 24, and then in 25, I sat in it again, in and out a couple of times.
just to kind of get a refresher on certain things. And I think that was extremely important for me to be able to go back and be like, okay, I can manage A, B, and C, but I can't get to D and E, there's just no way. So this year I went back and followed up with, okay, D and E, I need to focus in on those sort of things. That to me is very important. And obviously through your course, that's how I was able to do that.
Jenny (12:03)
Yeah, and I love that you're saying that too, because I think some flower farmers feel discouraged when they don't have all their ducks in a row in one season. And the reality is, it's just not going to happen like that. These things take time, right? And I'm always going back to the basics. And I feel like it's like a forever journey where
You get more advanced and you nail down a skill, but you can always get more advanced in that skill. Like I'm always coming back to the basics of marketing. I'm always coming back to like looking at my expenses and all the things that I teach in the course. I also like need those reminders for myself too, to go back and do it. You're always going to be working on these things throughout your business. There's never like a finish line that you get to. And so I love that you said that, that you're
Karen (12:44)
Mm-hmm.
Jenny (12:54)
you kind of prioritizing what your business needed first, and now you're continuing to work on all of those other things. So I think that's really great that you said that. And I wholeheartedly agree. That's how it is for most people. Now you said that you wanted to sign up for six figure flower farming because you wanted a concrete business plan with like no fluff, but what was it that specifically made you decide that this was something that you needed for your business to succeed?
Karen (13:25)
It was more of the, well, crop planning is always a challenge for me, so you
have a spreadsheet that will help out with crop planning. You can need to put in when your harvest came in. It's like all these different components put in together and it all filters down into what crops you need and how you go about figuring out what you need for next year and figuring out, you know, all right, well, X flower missed its mark because I planted it too late or I didn't have enough.
of I didn't do a second succession and it's important to do that. Well, all of this takes is taken into consideration through ⁓ what do you call that? The spreadsheet that's that into.
Jenny (14:09)
It's
just kind of like our crop planning process that, yeah.
Karen (14:11)
Okay.
Okay. So I think that was one of the main reasons is I was struggling with crop planning, struggling with keeping track of what I'm harvesting, when I'm sowing, when I'm harvesting, how much I actually need, any issues with crops, taking notes and just doing all of that. I wasn't doing it. I was out there cutting it, using it.
flying by the seat of my pants. So now there's much more structure to it and making sure that whatever goes into the cooler has a plan. It has notes, it has the week, the date and what it is, how much is in that bucket. And all of that is just following the plan. And when the plan flows, there's more peace, if you will, because you know that the plan works.
Jenny (15:05)
Yeah, I love hearing that. Yeah, crop planting is one of those things that for somebody who hasn't run like a legitimate farm before, you kind of think like, oh, crop planting, I'll just pick what flowers I want to grow and start them on this date and plant them on this date. And you kind of think that's all there is to it. But it's actually a lot more than that that goes into it to make sure that everything has
a place where it's going to go. It's fulfilling a piece of the puzzle. You're making sure that you have like a continuous harvest throughout the season. And you're looking at all of your different sales outlets and exactly how you're going to fulfill all of your projected sales through those different sales outlets. And it's one of my favorite things that we teach because there are so many pieces of it, but we kind of just try to distill it down and like have more easy to digest way to kind of just go through the process and
So people like you can find some peace throughout the season and just be like, all right, just, you know, got to follow the plan and go from there. So how has your mindset as a business owner kind of shifted over the years? Has there been anything mindset wise that has really changed for you since going through the program and working on your business like this?
Karen (16:09)
Mm-hmm.
Well, the mindset changes that it's actually running as a real business as opposed to, like I said, already flying by the seat of my pants and hoping that it works. But hoping that it works and flying by the seat of your pants doesn't actually give you the bottom line numbers. And through your course learning that you can analyze all of these components to figure out what a crop.
And it's not just the seed it's not just the soil. It's kind of like it's the man hours that go into it It's how much did that soil cost how much did the netting cost how much did it cost to flip a bed? What what amendments are you putting in it if you're doing any what about? ⁓ IPM like any fertilizer like all of these different things that you know you're not really thinking of it's like seed cost great is only going to cost me six bucks for this packet. It's it's
much more convoluted works. It's just more complicated than that. It isn't just so simple. So it's trying to figure out whether or not the whole picture works for your farm and making sure that you're keeping track of all of your expenses. ⁓ And in the beginning using
Jenny (17:24)
You
Karen (17:43)
I chose to put money back into the farm and I think it's worked out well because we do have, you know, we have a high tunnel, we've got a tractor, we've got implements and all that other stuff. But pretty soon I want to switch this over. Like I want to take in an income and I can't take in an income if I keep dumping money back in. So there needs to be a balance. Well that balance I'm finding or found through your course on how I get there. Like how do I make sure that I'm making sufficient money that I can cover my expenses.
and include a salary and make sure that I'm able to pay for the bulbs that are going to be coming in in a couple of weeks. I have to know how much that's all going to cost. So all of that matters.
Jenny (18:26)
Yeah. So it sounds like your mindset has really shifted to more of like a, don't know what you're describing to me is much more of like a CEO mindset. You're very analytical now and making sure that every decision you make really has a real purpose. It sounds like that's shifted a lot for you.
Karen (18:45)
Absolutely and it comes down to trying to figure out what other things can we do on the farm that's going to help us with managing our time so that includes ⁓ automating our ⁓ Irrigation it helps out with my you know everything obviously the plants you have to dial it in and work it all out So yeah, there were some hiccups with that this year, but it's part of the process ⁓ And then once we get like that automated irrigation dialed in ⁓
then that frees up time for my husband to do something else that needs to be done on the farm because there's always something to be done. Always, always something to be done.
Jenny (19:20)
Always. Yeah.
Well, I love that. That's very smart of you to be looking at things that you can automate, make faster, to free you up for more important things to do on the farm. Not more important, sometimes more important, but the more things that you can just streamline and simplify and automate, the better off you're going to be, right? Yeah. And like you said, that's.
Karen (19:35)
Thanks.
Mm-hmm.
Jenny (19:45)
There's always something to do. I, you know, I recently heard somebody say that their life got a lot easier when they just realized as a business owner, you're literally never going to be caught up. And I was like, you know, for some people that might be a good mindset to have to just be like, you know, there's always gonna be something to do. I'm just going to do the important things, do what I can and just realize like, there's always going to be that there and to not let it weigh you down. Like in a way it can be kind of freeing to think of things like that. So.
Karen (20:14)
Yeah, absolutely. It was kind of like the post office. They always have mail, right? There's always mail. There's always mail. So there's always going to be something to do. And trying to just manage the weight of all of it. And then trying to balance, you know, having a life. Like, you know, it would be nice to have a life. I mean, we did break from the farm to go to your on-farm workshop this year. mean, Dan didn't attend, but Dan was with me.
Jenny (20:15)
I thought that was interesting.
Yeah.
I love that.
Karen (20:41)
So it was nice to get away for a longer weekend. So that was nice and planning. That's another thing. Let's talk about that a second is that being after taking your course, looking at, making sure that all of the paperwork is filled out and keeping track of all of the numbers. It allows you to look back and say, I want to take a vacation in the summer. Where can I take it? So we can, like my husband and I have already looked at.
next year, we're like, okay, this week in August, it drops significantly. We can take that week off and it's not going to be a huge hit, or we can hire somebody to run the market for us. We have three, two of them are far away, so one of them we can have somebody at and at least have some income coming in. But we wouldn't be able to do that if we didn't keep track of what was going on. And so for both of us, it's on of enlightening. So now we come back from a market
And we figure out, you know, what we made this week. And then we look at what do we make last year? And like, what percentage did we increase or did we stay the same? So, and that allows us to say, okay, well, overall this year we're already up 27 % from last year. I'm happy with 27%. Would I be happier if it was 100? Heck yeah. But I'm very happy with 27.
Jenny (21:56)
Woo! ⁓
That's a huge jump in revenue.
Karen (22:07)
And if we stay at that 27 percent then this year we will be over and into the six figures. So yes. Yeah and I honestly I attribute so much of that to you, your course and honestly our tenacity to keep going. And you have that, you have that tenacity. Yeah without a doubt.
Jenny (22:16)
Yay!
You have to have it.
Yeah. Well, thank you for saying that, that so much of it has been attributed to what you've learned through us, but it's also you, you're the one who's implementing what you've learned and you're doing the work. And like you said, you have that tenacity and quite frankly, if a business owner doesn't have that tenacity and the perseverance to keep going, like they're not going to be a business owner for very long. And so that is.
It's a huge skill to have that you and Dan clearly have, and you're doing really well with it. And I know you told me before we got on the call and your email that you sent that your sales were up 27%. And then you also said that six figure flower farming was the best money you've spent on a course. And that just means so much to me that you said that because
hearing everything that you've been talking about, especially in the last five minutes when you've been talking about planning and data and all that stuff, it makes me so proud to see you doing this and to see the effect that it's having on your lifestyle. Do you know how many flower farmers have literally never taken a vacation or they're 10 years in and they still feel like they can never take a vacation? But because you have been keeping track of this data, the more data you have,
the better off you're going to be. Like you said, you can look back at it and you're planning your vacations based off of all that information that you've collected. And I heard you said that it's very enlightening. So, you know, a lot of people, think when they're, when they're faced with this, like, I need to like keep records or keep track of data. Like that sounds so like boring and it sounds like a lot of work, but really what you're saying is that it ends up being totally freeing and enlightening because it gives you the information you need to actually have a life outside of your business. Right?
Karen (24:18)
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I mean that clipboard sits in the in the barn on the table like we come in from harvesting. It's kind of like you need to write it down like there is no not writing it down. I mean if we are like really inundated and have a huge harvest coming in, it's like OK, so instead of saying we've got excuse me 100 stems of sunflowers, you're just going to say three buckets, three full buckets and OK, so we have a general idea of what that is. It's better than no record of it at all.
So, but keeping track of it is what is, like you just said, is allowing us to have the flexibility to figure out what we want to do to help us manage our lives and have some balance. Cause yeah, farming, as you know, can be very consuming. ⁓ Yeah. You come, you go, you get up early, you farm. If you work off the farm, you work off the farm, you come back home. Now you're sitting in front of your laptop. You've got seed catalogs. You've got to order.
Jenny (25:06)
It's all consuming.
Karen (25:16)
You got to all of these, these dates in order to have stuff for next year, not just for spring, but for summer. Like you're already planning and how do you, don't have time to do all of that if you're not spending the time keeping track of stuff.
Jenny (25:33)
And what would you say to somebody who feels like they don't have time to keep track of some of those records? Because I hear that a lot, like, just don't have time. I'm so busy, I don't have time. But for me personally, like our team, it takes like literally two minutes of a whole day to just jot down, OK, this is how much we're bringing to market. And then afterwards, this is how much we came home with. It literally takes like,
10 seconds to do that before you go to the market and when you come home. And for me, that few minutes gives me such insight into what's going on in my business to help me make some big decisions. But that's the thing that I hear a lot is like, I just don't have time. So what would you say to people like that?
Karen (26:23)
I was one of those people. How am I gonna do that? Don't I have enough to do? And then I did it and it's kinda like, it doesn't take all that long. Your handwriting doesn't have to be neat and orderly. You can set up a Google sheet and do it on your phone if you want to, if that's faster for you. There's many ways to ⁓ skin a cat, if you will, and write all this information down. But it does give you the...
Jenny (26:27)
Yeah.
Karen (26:49)
⁓ insights that you need later on. And we use your market sheet three times a week, every week, no fail. Even if we don't go, there's one, like, it's not that we don't go, like if there is no market, if there's a holiday, or if there's a weather cancellation. So then we're going to write a sheet and say, a market canceled. So that next year we're not scratching our heads going, well, what happened, you know, the week of August 22nd? I have no idea. I can barely remember stuff from three weeks ago, much less a year ago.
Jenny (27:19)
Yes.
Karen (27:19)
So writing that information down is critical. And a huge bonus too is writing down the components of your bouquets that you make for that week. It's kind of like I resisted doing it in the beginning. I'm like, why do I need to do this? But now all of a sudden some light bulb went on. I'm like, oh yeah, Jenny did say this. I'm like, duh. And it makes sense because now you can go back and look at it and it also assists with your crop planning.
and writing down your harvest ⁓ on a piece of paper, on a clipboard, you get to go now, go back and somebody asked me, when did ⁓ bowl of cream bloom last year? I don't know, let me go back and look. I'm like, yep, nope, it's not gonna make it for the beginning of May. I have a wedding to do the beginning of May. It's not gonna make it. So now I need to know that I need to order that. And if I hadn't kept those records, I have no idea when bowl of cream came to bloom.
So there's more to it than just writing it down. So. Yeah.
Jenny (28:24)
Feel so proud right now. Like, yes.
It's just so great to hear you say that because I just know so many flower farmers that their lives just feel so chaotic and stressful because they don't have that very simple data to just flip back on and be like, yeah, we should have this then, or we shouldn't have this then. Even though I've been growing flowers for
You know, well over a decade now, I still go back and look at those records to be like, okay, when did this specific variety start blooming? Like, just like you said, I do it all the time. And here's the thing that you said a minute ago is that you write it down because you can, you know, much less remember what happened last week and
That's so true. We always think we're going to remember, but then your brain is just full of so much stuff because you're a business owner and probably a parent or if you're not a parent, you've got other things going on and like you're not going to remember. So write it down.
Karen (29:28)
Yeah, absolutely write
it down because I don't like my kids are adults at this point, but that doesn't mean my life isn't isn't busy and I and you have so many things swirling around on top of if you work off of the farm, which both my husband and I do. So it's kind like I have my my work hat, you know, as a mental health therapist. So I've got to like all of that stuff going on and then come home and I'm like, OK, I got to take that hat off, which isn't always easy. And then then shift into a different gear.
Jenny (29:40)
Yeah.
Karen (29:58)
and kind of like, okay, now I need to put my flower farming hat on and I got to figure out, I got to get my order ready for springtime and manage how I'm going to do seeds, plugs, a combination of both. Think about whether or not I'm going to have employees or like, can I count on having employees in the spring or not? and deciding, do I do plugs? Do I do seeds? I'm doing plugs because I can't count on having employees with the track record that we have. So.
There's still going to be a ton of work to do, even if I have employees. It might just help free up things, but that's part of the planning process. And getting back to what we talked with, the question was, like, yeah, there's just so many things floating around. And when the pieces start to connect, makes things so much easier. Like I said before, ⁓ yeah, Jenny did say that, write these things down. Well, it didn't click in my head that there were other benefits to it than...
writing it down on a piece of paper.
Jenny (30:59)
Yeah, there's so much, so many benefits. just feel like, and a lot of people, someone said to me, I think actually might've been at the workshop this summer that you were at, the On Farm Workshop. Someone said like, oh, you're so lucky that this comes so naturally to you. And I was like, oh, no, no, this is not like my natural state at all. I just had to learn to put systems in place to keep track of this stuff so I can refer to it. it.
my business does run smoother and it does run better and quite frankly can run without me. Cause I'm kind of at that point right now where generally the day to day operations don't need that much of my input anymore. And it's only because I did all the things that, you know, I taught you in the course and in the workshop and I teach everyone else during the six figure flower farming business program. So, you know, on that same note,
Karen (31:31)
Mm-hmm.
Jenny (31:54)
Has anything changed in your business operations or daily routines as a result of things that you've learned over the past couple of years from the workshop and the course?
Karen (32:07)
leaning it more into ⁓ time blocking. that, you know, an employee who was here who recently left, you know, I would get up, I would think about, all right, what is it that we're doing? instead, once you first came in, I would be like, okay, we're gonna figure out what we're doing. And now it's kind of like, all right, I know, we're gonna first thing tomorrow morning, you're gonna come in and you're gonna do A, B and C.
Jenny (32:12)
Hmm.
Karen (32:33)
And she's going to go off and do those things on her own and then I'm going to be doing what I need to inside for a little bit and then I join her and that's really important it takes time to get to that point That's raining of employees is very important and sometimes challenging when you have an off-farm job it it's it's challenging and I will say that maybe that's part of
the reason why some of my employees are not here anymore. I mean, there are plenty of reasons, but I have to own my side of it, right? I'm not, sometimes I'm running around and I'm like, okay, I need you to harvest sunflowers, right? So, and then the person goes out there and they're chopping them four feet long. I'm like, we don't need them four feet long, right? Like, but if they don't know that, they don't know that. So I need to make sure that they are aware of how to go about doing this, or you don't go out into the field with dry buckets. Like you need to,
to train these things. And even though you train somebody, they still need to be followed for a period of time. And it's more challenging when you're leaving to ⁓ go to your job.
Jenny (33:37)
Yeah, I have to imagine that's super, super hard. I hired my first part-time employees. Did I? Yeah, I think I did. The year I quit my job was the same year.
Yeah. So I quit my job to work full time on the farm and that was the same time that I hired my first part-time employees. So I was right with them every step of the way they were shadowing me. They were, ⁓ you know, I was right there with them to train them. And when you're not there and fully present, it's gotta be really, really challenging. ⁓ but I want to say, I want to acknowledge that I can tell that your leadership skills have really improved since the beginning because
part of having strong leadership and developing a strong team is having that, okay, I have a plan. This is what the plan is instead of just being like, all right, let's figure out together what we're going to do today. Because most of the time your employees are like, well, I don't know what to do. And they're looking to you for guidance and reassurance and direction. And it sounds like that is really a skill that you've developed over the past little while, which is really great to have. And I know when I first started hiring team members, like
I did not have good management skills. I did not have good leadership skills. I mean, I think I was a really good boss, but that's like a whole other component of being a business owner that you have to learn. sounds like you're learning it and you're moving in the right direction, which is amazing.
Karen (35:09)
Yeah, I've got a lot to learn. It's difficult to, ⁓ if you're working with your husband, I know this past year, this past summer you had said like, how come your husband doesn't work on the farm? And you said, because I want to be married, know, X number of years from now. And it is challenging forever. I mean, yes. So it is challenging to work with family members, especially your husband when everybody has different...
Jenny (35:16)
You
forever, hopefully. Yeah. Yes.
Karen (35:37)
viewpoints on how things get done and it is challenging, it can be done, it's just kind of like I think the beginning years of trying to like get into the groove of what he's doing, what I'm doing and making sure our systems are working. We're a work in progress and I have to learn to separate my, you know, how you communicate with your spouse when employees are around.
It's like kind of hard to do. I need improvement.
Jenny (36:11)
It's really tough. I know, I know a lot of couples who farm together and they make it work or they love it. It depends on so many different things. Like I think it depends on your relationship and your personalities. And I also think that one of the things that will give you the best fighting chance is to have extremely clear roles and expectations. Like, you know, you are 100 %
In charge and owning like one bucket of the business while your husband is a hundred percent in charge and owning another bucket of the business. And that doesn't mean that you can't like collaborate and have discussions together, but having those like very clear roles and ownership of different pieces I think can help with that. ⁓ but yeah, it's, it's really tough. And you know, my husband, sometimes I think that if he was on the farm with me, like the
The farm would rock out. mean, we could, we could take it to the moon, you know, but me and him are both used to like being the boss. And when we worked together, cause he's like very much, he has a leadership position in his role and his job. And when we are like both in that role together, we clash sometimes and not, not in a bad way, but we just, we don't ever want to like resent each other and
This just works for us. And so that's the way it is, but other people, they find ways to do it together. And because you're a couple and you're like a team, you can really do amazing things together that way too. So just got to figure it out as you go, I think.
Karen (37:49)
It's just like anything else that we're doing on the farm. You figure it out as you go with some things and other things you need assistance with, like bringing this around back to your course. I I needed that to help me with the business end of it, and ⁓ it's helping.
Jenny (38:08)
Great. So if there's one thing you want flower farmers to kind of take away from your story, what would that be?
Karen (38:16)
I do think that education is important. I do think that going to ⁓ courses, whatever courses they may be, that are going to target what it is that you're looking for, try and find, ⁓ like dig deep into like what the person is saying before you sign up for a course. Cause sometimes you're going to take a course and you're like, this is all fluff. I don't want fluff. want real. ⁓ So I had taken other courses that were
under the guise of being business. And it was like, that's not what I was looking for. I wanted some depth and I found it with your course. And that's why I said what I said in my little intro was that I found it. And in speaking with, I found some friends through the Six Figure Flower Farm that we're still communicating today. And we both are like, this was ⁓ a fabulous course to take, the Six Figure Flower Farming. It's because it gave you the substance that is
absolutely needed and you're not paying me to say this. I paid you to take the course and I'm happy that I did because like I've said throughout this whole conversation is that it was invaluable to me to learn how to do this that side of the business from somebody who has already done it and is working it and is still doing it. So that's my my fault.
Jenny (39:42)
Well, thank you for all of your super kind words. It really means a lot to me. And it's just so rewarding for me to see, to talk to you today and to hear all of the great improvements that you've made and the direction you're going in. I can see the skills that you've acquired and it's just so amazing to hear from students and all the results that they've gotten. ⁓ It just...
It makes me feel really, really happy. And like my purpose is sort of being fulfilled. And I just want to help as many flower farmers as possible build that profitable and sustainable business. Like you need both parts, right? Like you have to have financial security. Like, no, we're probably not going to get wealthy doing this, but like, do you have to have that financial security, but you also have to have a life. You can't just be on the farm 24 seven. ⁓
unless that's your thing, but you have family and you have other hobbies and you have a life outside of it. And so that you need both pieces to be profitable and sustainable. what advice would you give somebody who might be considering joining six figure flower farming, but is maybe feeling hesitant about it or not sure if it's for them?
Karen (41:02)
⁓ I think everything that I've said during this talk today is in support of absolutely taking the course. I think that it is imperative to know your numbers, how to use your numbers in your favor and to figure out whether or not a particular crop is worth it for you, whether it's time to invest in a high tunnel or not, whether it's time to take the leap and
quit your off farm job. All of these things are fueled by information. And if you don't have that information, you're taking a shot in the dark is really what ends up happening. And if that's what you like, then great. It just doesn't work for me. ⁓ I'm at a stage in life where I'm...
older than many of the people that are going into flower farming and I'm using some of my retirement money and I need this to work and if I want this to work I have to have the education to support it and be able to run my business the way it should be run and not just
you know, throwing flowers in a rubber band at the end of my driveway and hoping that people drive by and stop and then I make money off of it. It doesn't work. There's just too many other components to go into it. taking a course where somebody has 10 plus years of business experience in flower farming is absolutely well worth it. And I said it during the summer workshop, like, you know your stuff. And that's what made me
Convinced me that okay. Yeah Was it a little hard to hit that button? Sure, but after I took the course I have no qualms I would do it again in a heartbeat and I did I took another course from you I took the on on farm workshop. So what does that say about you? I'm willing to spend more money on the things that you can teach me about Flower farming and flower business and how I can make it work
for me and my husband in our business.
Jenny (43:18)
Well, that's awesome. so Karen, you took, when did you sign up for six figure flower farming? Was it your, when you were going into your second year of flower business or first?
Karen (43:30)
It was, so I had microgreens for two years. So it was, and then I had like a, a trial period. So this is, going into my third year of flower farming. So
I was in my going into my second year.
Jenny (43:47)
Yeah. And so do you feel like that has really set you up for success? Because I know I hear some people say like, oh, you know, I'm not ready to learn this stuff yet. I need to have more experience first. um, you know, and I used to kind of think that too, but I think I've changed my mind on it. And I'm curious to hear what, what your answer is to that. If you think it set you up for success or if it was too early for you to take it, what do you think about that?
Karen (44:12)
Initially, I did think that it would have been ⁓ better to take it a little bit later, like into like your second year of really my second year, we were still doing microgreens. So we were doing two businesses at the same time. So ⁓ it was a lot of information that was needed. I think what might be valuable for you is to when people when you start, you know, when people start signing up is asking them, ⁓ start keeping track of your records now.
And then just simplistically, just write, what's your harvest? Write down the number, write down the date and all of that information. But moving forward with it being in my third year and using your information, I think that it could be, it was beneficial to have it. had more aha moments as I was going through the year flower farming into my third year. ⁓ Understanding why.
keeping the harvest records are important, how that impacts crop planning, how keeping track of all of the nitty gritty expenses of trays and soil and fertilizer and blah, blah, blah, all of these things ⁓ impacts how your course integrates with everything. So I'm kind of, I'm kind of like, I can see their point initially, but after the fact, I can see where it doesn't really matter.
You're going to have that information and as you're doing it, you're gonna be like, okay, now this makes sense. All right. I understand that this information here is going to plug in over here. So I think it could be beneficial either way. I
Jenny (45:51)
always yeah, just curious what people think about it. well, Karen, I, just want to say thank you so much for coming on today. It has just been truly an honor to work with you through six figure flower farming and having you on the farm for the workshop this summer. And I've really loved getting to know you. And I've been especially excited to see all the progress that you've made and all the results you've gotten. And I know
where you're headed and I'm really excited to watch you go there. ⁓ tell everyone where they can find you online and maybe follow you if they're interested.
Karen (46:27)
So our business is Greenhouse on Greendell and that's what our social handles are for. We just use Facebook and Instagram. ⁓ as Jenny was saying, it's kind of like, you know, we want to keep up with like hobbies and stuff. Well, behind me is my hobby that I haven't had much time for. However, I am taking some time off the farm and I have a quilt retreat that starts tomorrow and lasts all weekend. So I am taking some
off farm time for me and have some people helping us and my husband will take care of the markets. So it's nice. It's nice to be able to do that.
Jenny (47:07)
Yay.
And I'm so glad to hear that you're doing that and that you're able to do that because of all the hard work that you've put into your business. have fun on the quilting retreat. That's so awesome. Both my mom and my mother-in-law used to be really into quilting. And they've sort of like, I don't think they're doing it as much anymore, but they would love to do something like that. I might have to put you in touch with them. Awesome.
Karen (47:15)
Yes.
Mm-hmm. Please do, please do. I met
your mom. I don't know if I met your mother-in-law. No. Okay.
Jenny (47:33)
I don't think so. I don't think she was here on the farm. I think they were
camping. Yeah, they were like camping or something when you were here visiting, but yeah. So, ⁓ thank you again for being here and for all of the super kind words. I really appreciate everything and, ⁓ yeah, everyone go follow Karen and we'll keep in touch. So thank you guys for being here for this episode is a six figure flower farming podcast and we'll see everyone next time.
Karen (47:40)
Mm-hmm.
Jenny (48:03)
Have a good one. Bye.
Karen (48:04)
Bye.
Jenny (48:07)
If you enjoyed this episode and want to get results like the students I've been featuring on the podcast recently, like Karen, like Krissa and Bill and Leanne and literally hundreds of other small scale flower farmers, I want to let you know that Six Figure Flower Farming, the online business course is now open for registration for a very, very short time from November 4th, 2025 through November 13th, 2025.
So you can enroll in the course only between November 4th and 13th, 2025. And I'm really not sure when we're going to be opening up registration for this course again. Previously, I've only taught it once a year. So now is the time to get signed up. If you want to take your flower farm and your lifestyle to completely new heights at the end of 2025 and in 2026. So to get signed up, head over to our website, which is trademarkfarmer.com.
forward slash enroll starting on November 4th to get signed up. And I just really hope I can see you inside of the course. I know that this can get you the results you're looking for. It's been proven over and over again and it's just the best thing ever. So when you're ready, head on over to trademarkfarmer.com forward slash enroll to check it out and sign up today.
